Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

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Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby lacompfun on Mon Jun 26, 2017 6:19 pm

The Defense pays $ 2,000 on labor code 5710 fees

AA for some reason submits a labor code 5710 fee petition and the judge issues an order for $ 1,200 . So not new money just total amount due is $ 1,200.

Question:

1. if neither side objects to the Judge order does AA owe Defendant $ 800?
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby 50Cal20 on Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:00 am

What a great question. I don't know if this scenario has ever been previously addressed. But I do know that the opposite scenario has occurred numerous times where a defendant paid $1,200 for LC 5710 fees only to have the Board Order $2,000 be paid, resulting in the defendant paying an additional $800. I see no reason why this would be a one-way situation. The defendant should ask for a $800 refund.
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby LawAdvocate on Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:15 am

The order was for 5710 fees in the amount of $1,200 without clarification as to new money, so ALL Orders which do not specify per civil law are then for the total amount owed. If you have paid any portion previously, you pay the balance with interest unless interest was waived.
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby steve appell on Tue Jun 27, 2017 10:09 am

The 5710 Order in this scenario is payable @ $1200 because the order does not specify less prior payments, and the order does not specify the date of the depo. Therefore, the order may or may not apply to the depo that the defendant paid $2000. Also, Defendants are not entitled to a refund for over advancing indemnity payments. Naturally a defendant may assert/petition for a credit towards future indemnity payments owed.

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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby ozzie on Tue Jun 27, 2017 10:18 am

I'm going with LawAdvocate's position: the AA owes money back. The AA clearly charged too much.

If the AA disagrees, then the AA has to file a Petition for Reconsideration. It's a final order.
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby LawAdvocate on Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:41 pm

??? 5710 fees are not INDMENITY payments and don't even come from an indemnity reserve. They are an allocated expense, refund is allowed for duplication in payment. IN fact that is a good way to lose your bar card. Keep unearned fees that will do you in.
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby steve appell on Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:23 am

Allocated Expense is not reportable on the Unit Stat or to the WCIRB. Therefore, Allocated Expense should not & does not affect the Experience Modification. An Allocated Expense is not subject to WCAB jurisdiction IE: IV cost, def att cost, adjuster expenses etc. Regardless of what bucket it comes from, 5710 is CLEARLY a med legal expense as it is payable to an AA and charged back to the file. 5710 is not an Allocate Expense because an Allocated expense is a fee paid to a vendor to assist in defending the claim that can not be charged back to the file and therefore can not be used on the books to raise ER premium. In fact, I would say that any money whatsoever paid to an AA by the IC is med legal and not allocated expense due to the aforementioned reasons...
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby steve appell on Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:50 am

CORRECTION
I would say that any money whatsoever paid to an AA by the IC is ((med legal or indemnity)) and not allocated expense due to the aforementioned reasons...
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby LawAdvocate on Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:26 pm

I would respectfully disagree. AA Deposition fees for depositions of Applicants are not even classified as medical-legal expenses and AAs are not paid for cross-examinations of medical-legal providers.

So AA depo fees are not defined anywhere in the code as medical legal costs. The references are:

Labor Code §4620(a) defines the term: “a medical-legal expense means any costs and expenses incurred by or on behalf of any party, the administrative director, or the board, which expenses may include Xrays, laboratory fees, other diagnostic tests, medical reports, medical records, medical testimony, and, as needed, interpreter’s fees... for the purpose of proving or disproving a contested claim.”

Defined further in 8 CCR §9793(h), “Medical-legal expense” means any costs or expenses incurred by or on behalf of any party or parties, the administrative director, or the appeals board for X-rays, laboratory fees, other diagnostic tests, medical reports, medical records, medical testimony, and as needed, interpreter's fees, for the purpose of proving or disproving a contested claim. The cost of medical evaluations, diagnostic tests, and interpreters is not a medical-legal expense unless it is incidental to the production of a comprehensive medical-legal evaluation report, follow-up medical-legal evaluation report, or a supplemental medical-legal evaluation report and all of the following conditions exist...

8 CCR 10205 defined “Cost” to mean “any sum that is not included as an allowable lien under Labor Code section 4903 at the time of filing, but may be allowable under another section of the Labor Code. “Costs” include, but are not limited to: (1) deposition attorneys' and interpreters' fees under section 5710; (2) medical-legal expenses, including interpreters' fees, under section 4620 on or after January 1, 2013; (3) fees related to copy service or subpoena under section 5710; and (4) costs claimed under section 5811.” Changes have been proposed that would expand this definition.

So again absent your source and evidence, no CCR 10205(h) plainly states LC 5710 fees are COSTS, meaning allocated expense.
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Re: Labor Code 5710 fees (California)

Postby jpod on Wed Jun 28, 2017 2:08 pm

I'm not sure it makes much difference in my world of self-insurance but it might for insurers who issue premiums for coverage.

But having said that and for the sake of continuing the discussion what about the code LawAdvocate cited §4620(a) which states:

Labor Code §4620(a) defines the term: “a medical-legal expense means any costs and expenses incurred by or on behalf of any party, the administrative director, or the board, which expenses may include .....

While the list makes no reference to depo fees paid to A/A it does say "which may include..." ...so doesn't that mean the list is not a complete list? And if the list is not a complete list wouldn't a 5710 fee be a "cost" incurred by "any party" to prove or disprove a claim? The cost being one incurred by defendant to depose EE to prove or disprove a claim.
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